Tuesday, October 02, 2007
More than Puzzled......
I was watching some TV yesterday while on the treadmill and heard some moronic commentator talking about how (due to Auburn's defeat of Florida) the SEC is PROBABLY the 2nd best conference in the nation. The only evidence cited for this was that USC played Nebraska and won.......and, so what? A quick look at this weeks polls and the schedules played thus far show that the AP voters have 5 SEC teams in the top 12, while the Coach's Poll has 4 SEC teams in that range. Pac 10? AP- 3 in top 14, Coach's- 3 in top 13. We'll call that one point for the SEC. When looking at a brief schedule check, yes...No 2 (AP) USC did beat Nebraska, No. 14 at the time, # 25 now.....but # 1 (AP) LSU beat Va. Tech, No. 9 at the time, # 15 today. We'll call that another point for the SEC. But wait, you might say....didn't Cal beat Tennessee? That is certainly a point for the Pac 10. OK, you can have that point if you want......but I would think it would be a "push" to be more accurate....as the game was played at Cal (currently No. 3) and against a Vol team that is 2-2 (two losses to top 10 teams....and very capable of winning this weekend). Giving a point to the Pac 10 for that win would be like giving Kentucky or Florida a win for beating Arizona (give a quick look at their schedule to find why I compare them to Tenn at this point). I don't think anyone would grant the SEC points for such a win, as it is expected. If you look at that Cal-Tenn game more closely, anyone would agree that Tenn lost that game more than Cal won as well...which is another reason for a "push"....but we'll give that point to the Pac 10 anyway. At this point, we are 2-1 in favor of the SEC with very little evidence cited....which is where I thought the rest of you might like to play. Give points for the Pac 10 or SEC and cite your reasons why. For example- you might give the SEC a point for strength for the fact that a struggling Auburn team could go into the Swamp and defeat a rolling Gator bunch. That would seem reasonable to me, although the moron yesterday pointed that out as a reason to drop the SEC down. My thought is that since almost any SEC team can beat almost any other SEC team on a given day....that is strength, not weakness. Granted, this Pac 10 lover will likely use the fact that either LSU or Florida will lose this week as another reason to drop the SEC.....and we still have to listen to his crap if ESPN is on in the afternoon. Thoughts?
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7 comments:
Ok, Wanted to respond yesterday and didn't get a chance.....my feeling is this....it is impossible to come to a conclusion on this topic because SEC and Pac-10 teams don't play that often....I think if you take the teams from each conference top to bottom (historically) the argument for the SEC is fairly strong. My hope this year is that is comes down to LSU and USC and that the Tigers roll big so the media can break off its love affair with Pete Carrol and the Trojans....I like your reasoning and I think it is a fair way to look at it. I'll expand it to the top 15 AP.....Pre season poll had 4 SEC teams and 3 Pac-10 teams...
SEC - LSU(2), Florida(6), UGA(13), TN(15)
Pac-10 USC(1), Cal(12), UCLA(14)
The AP as of today has 5 SEC teams in top 15 and 3 Pac-10 teams...
SEC - LSU(1), UK(8), Fla(9), SC(11), UGA(12),
Pac-10 - USC(2), Cal(3), OR(14)
Of the SEC Group 2 are undefeated all others have 1 loss to a conference team. Of the Pac-10 group 2 are undefeated and the third has a loss to a conference team (Cal). The team that fell out of the top 15 pre-season (UCLA) has a 4-0 conf. record but lost to Utah and were replaced by OR...who beat a hungover Mich team. The SEC team that fell out was TN who lost to Cal and Fla. They were replaced by SC and UK.
So I have it 5 to 2 with the Pac-10 getting a point for the only Head to Head win....brings it to 5-3 SEC.
Now....lets look at the rest of the teams in each conference.....
SEC (Others) Vandy, TN, AL, AUB, Miss. St., Ark, Miss
Of this group there are four losses to out of conference teams....they are Cal(#3), FSU, USF(#6)and Missouri(#17)
Pac-10 (others) ASU, AZ, OR. St., Wash., WSU, Stanford, UCLA
Of this group there are 6 out of conference losses....they are BYU, New Mex., Cincy, OSU(#4), Wisc.(#5) and Utah.
SEC has 3 out of the 4 that are ranked and the other is a pretty good team....Pac-10 has 2 out of the 6 ranked and the others are nobody.
SEC-1.....Pac-10-nothing
6-3 SEC
Let's make a schedule of the comp teams in each conference by record
LSU(5-0) vs USC(5-0)
UK(5-0) vs Cal(5-0)
Fla(4-1) vs OR(4-1)
SC(4-1) vs ASU(5-0)
UGA(4-1) vs UCLA(4-1)
Vandy(3-1)vs AZ(2-3)
AL(3-2) vs OR.St(2-3)
AUB(3-2) vs Wash.(2-3)
MSU(3-2) vs WSU(2-3)
TN(2-2) vs Stanford(1-3)
Ark(2-2) and Ole Miss(1-4) sit out.
In my opinion...if this schedule were to be played the top four game could be a push (although I think it would be 4-1 SEC) But below those top 4....the SEC runs away with it.
7-3 SEC.....so out of 10 points the SEC takes it with the cherry on top being LSU beating the mess out of USC.
I just spend 20 minutes writing my thoughts then decided to write this. You don't know until December. That is when you can start this debate.
We won't know then either....
I agree...we go to ASU next Sept. anyone up for a road trip next year? i think it is hard to debate because we don't watch all the PAC 10 games. We only see the league games when team take their best shot at USC or Cal
How about this one.....
in Bowl Matchups.....
Las Vegas Bowl-
Pac 10 #4, MWest #1
Hawaii Bowl-
Pac 10 at large, WAC at large
Emerald Bowl-
Pac 10 #5, ACC # 7
Independence Bowl-
SEC #8, Big 12 #7
Holiday Bowl-
Pac 10 #2, Big 12 #3
Music City Bowl-
SEC at-large, ACC #5
Sun Bowl-
Big East or 12 at-large, Pac 10, #3
Liberty Bowl-
Con USA #1, SEC #6
Chick-fil-A
ACC #2, SEC at-large
Cotton Bowl-
Big 12 #2, SEC at-large
Outback Bowl-
Big Ten #3, SEC at-large
Capital One Bowl-
SEC #2, Big Ten #2
In these games, the pre-set teams are normally what you see above. Obviously, a BCS bid for the # 1 team from each conference is expected, and there is a possibility that 2 teams could go, which would shift the other numbers. However, the Pac 10 (TRADITIONALLY) is assumed to have six teams qualify for bowls. 1 BCS game and 5 others. Of those other 5 bowls, the Pac 10 is matched up against a higher seeded team from another conference in only 2 of the 5 bowls (for the sake of this argument, we'll assume an "at-large" number will qualify as a lower seeding....and we'll assume that an "at-large" from the Pac 10 will be a lower seed than one from the WAC). If you compare that with the SEC, it is assumed that 8 teams will qualify for the bowls (1 BCS and 7 other bids). Of the seven other bowl games, only one (Capital One Bowl) matches up an SEC team with an equal seed from another conference. The other 6 games all assume that a lesser SEC team will be competitive with a higher seeded team from another conference.
If you look at the BCS games as well, you will notice that the SEC has had 2 teams in those bowls 4 times, which obviously bumps the other seeded teams down in the other bowls, while the Pac 10 has had only 2 years with more than one BCS team.
BCS Games-
1999- SEC- 2
Pac 10- 1
2000- SEC- 2
Pac 10- 1
2001- SEC- 1
Pac 10-2
2002- SEC- 2
Pac 10- 1
2003- SEC- 1
Pac 10- 2
2004- SEC- 1
Pac 10- 1
2005- SEC- 1
Pac 10- 1
2006- SEC- 1
Pac 10- 1
2007- SEC- 2
Pac 10- 1
Don't know how much of a butt-kicking that is for the SEC over the Pac 10- but its a pretty wide gap at this point no matter how you add up the points.
It's the same old crap...
JUST take the SEC East this year, look at it now, with GA, KY, SC, TN, FL, and Vandy. Spread them out to any other 6 conferences, I'd say 4-5 are ranked at the end of the year and 4-5 are competing for the conference championship and 3-4 win it going away.
SEC rolls, then they start playing each other and beating each other up, and everyone drops, while moron media guy or fan says, "Look, they're down." No, you can't take an intra-conference matchup and make that assessment. By the end of the conference slate, you'll have someone emerge as the best of the best (usually) or 2-3 2 loss teams, but the point is, the SEC team that goes 9-3, 8-4, is BCS material in these top heavy wanna be conferences.
Look at Tech's conference schedule last year. Virginia, Va Tech, Maryland, Clemson, Miami, NC State, UNC, Duke. Toughest on there was probably Va Tech, which we handled. Then Clemson. Guys, if we DON'T go 11-1 on that slate, we should fire some coaches.
Chunk-
This is really eating at you. Great research! My suggestion is the PAC 10-SEC challenge in 2009. Like the ACC-Big 10 in hoops. This would prove who is the better conference. 10 games. Here are the games. LSU vs. USC, UGA vs. Oregon, Florida @ Cal, Tenn vs. ASU, Auburn @ Washington, Alabama vs. WSU, Oregon State @ Arkansas, South Carolina @ UCLA, Kentucky vs. Arizona, Vandy @ Stanford...I think SEC would be favored in at least 8.
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